The Pension Blueprint podcast video transcript 

Episode: More than a job: Why choose public service?

Celine • Wendy • Amy • Domenic

0:00 Introduction

Celine: Welcome to The Pension Blueprint. I'm Celine Chiovitti, Chief Pension Officer at OMERS, and your host. A fulfilling career is about more than a paycheck. More and more people are looking for work that offers purpose, opportunities to grow, and the chance to make a real difference. So what makes public service such a rewarding career? And how can employers attract the next generation of talent? Today, I'm joined by three leaders from across the public sector. Wendy Stephansen, City Manager for the City of Ottawa, Amy Parker, Manager of Total Compensation and HR Systems at the City of Guelph, and Domenic Maugeri, Secretary-Treasurer of CUPE Local 416. Together, we'll explore how public service careers are evolving, why purpose matters, and what organizations are doing to build workplaces where people can thrive.

Celine: So, let's get into it.

Celine: Hello, everyone, and welcome to The Pension Blueprint.

Amy: Hi.

Domenic: Hello.

Wendy: Good morning, everybody. It's great to be here.

Celine: I have been so looking forward to having this conversation about purpose and work and public service. And I just feel like we need to talk more about the phenomenal career opportunities in public service.

Celine: And fun fact, I started my very first job, my first real job, was at the former City of Etobicoke, and I just fell in love with community and service, and I feel like it's really shaped who I am.

1:37 Paths into Public Service

Celine: So, I would love to hear more about the three of you, what you do and what made you say yes to public service. And maybe, Wendy, I will start with you.

Wendy: Oh, thank you so much, Celine. It's a really interesting story. My parents were school teachers, and I grew up in a household where public service was an everyday thing, and I saw the impact that they had on the children in the community and the work that they did, and I kind of brought that with me as I started my work life.

Wendy: I applied to a newspaper ad in a local paper for a job, what was then known as the region of Ottawa-Carleton, which has become the City of Ottawa, and started my career with municipal government three decades ago.

Wendy: And one of the beautiful things I will say in terms of the career that I've had, I mean, the people are the best in terms of what you do and what you see and who you work with. But for me, I was actually able to transfer my pension from the federal government to OMERS.

Celine: We love to hear that.

Wendy: Gave me extra service, which was truly amazing.

Wendy: But again, it's really the impact that you see on the community every day, and that's what I love about what I do here.

Celine: So true, so true. Domenic, how about you?

Domenic: Yeah, child of Italian immigrants. I started working, I think, since I was three years old. There's no such thing as babysitting where we're from.

Domenic: But I did start in the city when I was 19 in Toronto Community Housing. They were originally part of the province and under a different pension plan. In 2000, they were downloaded, and then I became a member of OMERS. So I've been with you all for a very long time, but I was a labourer.

Domenic: And then I went back to school for trades about a few years into it. Got my trades certificate, worked for TCHC, and then eventually moved up through the union ranks.

Celine: That's great. Thank you. Amy?

Amy: Hi, so I've been with the City of Guelph for 26 years. City of Guelph was basically my first career position as well. I started through a temp agency, and I was supposed to be there for three days and 26 years later, I'm still there.

Amy: The wonderful part about Guelph for me is I was born and raised, went to high school, university, and now I've been able to enjoy my entire career at the City of Guelph. So I've basically grown my career in Guelph as well.

Amy: I started in just HR assistance, moved through payroll pension benefits, was an HR advisor for a little stint, and now I've landed as a manager of total compensation.

Celine: That's so great. I think for each of you, I mean, and I've spoken a little bit about my past, it is this sort of you come, you don't actually know exactly. I don't know that any of us set out to sort of spend a career in the space, but you just get drawn in.

4:34 Building a Career and Growing Talent

Celine: And one of the things that I want to ask you, Wendy, because you talked about your career in Ottawa, and you're now city manager, you've got sort of a top job. And I'm really focused on, it feels like in today's Instagram, everything's an Instagram life, it's instant success. And the reality is you talked about a long career, and sometimes throughout the career, there are peaks and valleys, and you're moving laterally and horizontally. And so can you talk a little bit about what are the fundamental, if you think of the values that you have brought into work in that sort of long career span, what has set you apart, if you will, from others?

Wendy: Sure. And I think there's really two things. Think about being community-minded and building a community. And the second is really service excellence, right? And doing the best that you can in the job that you're in.

Wendy: And when I reflect back, I've been very privileged to have a long career here at the city and have many opportunities. And I think about a municipality. You think about all the different lines of business that we have and all the different things that you can do. That is a huge attraction, right? In terms of welcoming new people into the organization.

Wendy: And I just think about my own career journey. When I came in, I had the opportunity to build something from the ground up, which I might've not had anywhere else. And from there, I'm gonna say I took some side steps. I learned so much, went to different departments, made some step upwards in the organization.

Wendy: But I think it's also about how the organization supports employees and how they're coaching, how they're mentoring, how they're putting programs in place to grow them. So they're gonna stay at the city. And that's one of the things that I'm very proud of here in terms of what we've done, really not only to attract, but to retain people here.

Celine: I often think about a career as almost a partnership, right? I think you spoke about excellence. I think there is like the reality of doing the work, doing it the best that you can do, no matter what the role is. And then that leading to more opportunities. And then in return, the employer, making sure you're having the conversations and showing the pipeline and succession planning. And I think of municipalities as a whole, you're in the long game, right? Like it's a great place to be able to build your career.

7:06 Recruiting the Next Generation

Celine: Amy, what are some of the challenges? You work in HR, you recruit. What are you hiring for? What's changing? What challenges do you sort of see in this space?

Amy: So I don't directly recruit. However, I am well aware of the challenges that we're having for specific positions, especially highly technical roles. Planners for the last little while, due to the housing crisis. Every municipality has been hiring planners and there's not enough of them to go around. So that has been a bit of a challenge.

Amy: Also positions like engineers, very highly skilled employees. Having people in those roles, they have more options because they might want to consider private versus public. With the City of Guelph, both our planners and our engineers are unionized. Whereas in other municipalities, they are not. So sometimes that can be a bit of a challenge where we may be limited on what we can offer them as a starting salary or the amount of vacation. If they were to go somewhere else, they might have different opportunities.

Amy: However, Guelph is a wonderful place to learn and grow your career. So we've found we've gotten lots of great people to join our team and luckily those roles have been filled.

Celine: Yeah, Domenic, you represent over 8,000 members, I believe in the public service in Toronto. Tell us a little bit about the jobs that they do and why are they joining and like what's important to them?

Domenic: Yeah, so I'll get in trouble for naming three out of the 12 I represent. So I'm gonna name the few if you don't mind.

Domenic: But I represent many members: Animal Services, Corporate Services, Fleet and Forestry, Enwave Energy, OASIS, Parks and Recreation, Ports Toronto, Solid Waste, Toronto Community Housing, Toronto Paramedic Services, Toronto Parking Authority, Toronto Seniors Housing, Toronto Water, Transportation and Yorktown Family Services.

Celine: So basically, if you live in Toronto—

Domenic: One of our members is serving you.

Celine: You're paying dues, yeah.

Domenic: All right, we figured that out for outside workers. So back to the question.

Domenic: Yeah, we represent many workers. They have an opportunity, I think our guest spoke about advancement. We are partners with the City of Toronto. We're proud of that. They have a chance to start a career as I did and move on to other things. So that's what we're proud of. We're proud to represent these members.

Domenic: I think there's a cost of consistency for public service over private. I've worked both where I'm from in the construction industry prior to starting in the city. As a teen, it was feast or famine. You either worked really well for a few months and then you were off for a bit.

Domenic: While times are changing, I think our members are realizing the pension and the cost of consistency is something they value and an opportunity to move up in the city.

Celine: I love that you're talking about sort of the cost of consistency and we've been, you know, often from a pension perspective, it's so hard to show young members the value of a pension because it's just so far in the future.

Celine: But really trying to sort of demonstrate, especially in a chaotic world, having something to rely on, whether it's sort of stable work and income or knowing that you're putting money away into the future is so important.

10:19 Supporting Workers in a Changing World

Celine: Wendy, I'm gonna come back to you for a minute. What are some of the biggest challenges facing municipalities today? And what are you doing to sort of future-proof, if you will, Ottawa?

Wendy: You know, when I think about what's happened during COVID and, you know, our workforce of today, things really changed during COVID. I'm gonna say we did things that we never thought we could do in terms of how our workforce adapted, adapted so well in terms of pivoting and providing the service that we needed to provide during COVID.

Wendy: And coming out of that, we learned so much in terms of how we changed the way we delivered service. The innovation was incredible, but we also learned that we also needed to take care of our people. And their well-being was really important, you know, through COVID and coming out of COVID.

Wendy: And so thinking about, you know, that look forward, when we're wanting to retain or attract people here, those things are so important in terms of attracting new talent to our organization and retaining talent.

Wendy: Think about, you know, that total compensation package. The OMERS pension is one of them that's absolutely an amazing benefit.

Celine: I love to hear that.

Celine: Domenic, I wanna talk a little bit about the realities facing all of us today. Earlier at the annual meeting, we talked about, you know, the continued sort of economic and political volatility, the fact that we've got such a high cost of living right now, low housing affordability. There's a ton of research that just basically says workers are feeling stretched and so difficult, you know, just to make ends meet, let alone save for the future. Are your members feeling that? Do you talk to them about that? What can we do to help in that area?

Domenic: We have members on all wage scales, you know, up to $200,000, right down to 50, 60,000. No one's at the lower end, we're trying to fight to bring them up. We're working with municipalities, retention that we said is difficult, but also recruitment.

Domenic: We're doing job fairs, we're partnering with them. I think OMERS should join some of those job fairs as well, explaining the value of a pension versus the private sector work that may just give an RRSP, but they are struggling. There's solutions out there. I think we can work together.

Domenic: Members are finding it difficult to live and work in the city. At the same time, they're coming in from far. We're trying to work with the City of Toronto, possibly OMERS and others to get workforce housing, to see if there's something for our own workers to live, work and continue playing in the City of Toronto.

Domenic: It is difficult, inflation, cost of living, housing has gone up and wages has been stagnant for some time and until recently, and this municipal government has in Toronto finally stepped up and said, we're going to pay for the work we've just recently signed for retention pay for paramedics to give them the same respect as police and fire to show that if you're going to work in one of the toughest cities for call volume, that the City of Toronto is going to respect that.

Domenic: And we did that working, as you said earlier, collaboratively with the City of Toronto, with Ontario government and trying to find a solution to retain and recruit staff.

Celine: Yeah, I feel like the pandemic actually really put such a positive spotlight on municipal services. And I think everybody really started to understand the importance of community and the services that you rely on every day and don't necessarily think about.

13:57 Pensions and Financial Confidence

Celine: Amy, what do you think our role is sort of as employers and as pension plans and sort of helping our members and our employees think about their financial future? Do you think we have a role to play?

Amy: I definitely think we have a role to play. And similar to what Domenic was saying about having OMERS come and speak at job fairs, I think early education about pension is very important.

Amy: Our new workers, they come in, they're interested in flexibility, they want to ensure they have the appropriate benefits, but they might not be thinking about pension yet, especially if they're at a younger age and starting their career. So I think early education for new employees would be wonderful.

Amy: OMERS comes to the employer and has provided information sessions for us. And what I've noticed over the last couple of sessions is we have more attendance from people that are early career and mid-career.

Amy: In the past, it was always those employees who are looking at the next five to 10 years, maybe out, they're trying to actually retirement plan and prepare and know when they can go.

Amy: But having younger, newer employees join is a great sign that they're realizing how important the pension is to them to provide stability, to provide so many things for their potentially growing families. And so they'll have a great income when it does come time to retire.

Celine: Yeah, Wendy, you mentioned earlier that you now can have part-time employees join. We opened up the plan to non-full-time employees back in 2023, and we've had over 150,000 non-full-time employees join and it's optional. And they, on average, are younger than the full-time sort of demographic, which just anecdotally tells me that people are really starting to think about their financial future.

Celine: And we've dug into data around young people that says that. When we talk about it as a pension that feels so distant and that's for their parents or grandparents, they wanna talk about money. People are trying to find a way to sort of say, how do I build financial resilience for ourselves in the future? And it's with everything that people are facing right now, knowing that you have access to this, like whether you feel like you're saving or not, you actually are doing something good for your financial futures.

Celine: I think there's just so many ways we can come together to partner in this space.

16:28 Giving Back to the Community

Celine: Final question to each of you. Someone is just starting out in their career. Why should they consider public service? I'm gonna start with you, Amy.

Amy: For myself personally, the ability to give back to your community and be a part of that is a significant reason to why I've stayed in public service.

Amy: The ability to move through so many different areas of business, similar to what Wendy was saying earlier, there are so many opportunities, so many different lines of business that the opportunities are endless, especially if you're starting out young, you're willing to learn and grow.

Amy: There's a career pathway for you somewhere, and you just never know where it's gonna go with a larger organization.

Celine: Thank you. Domenic?

Domenic: For me, started as a job, but then I realized it is a career. I give back to my community, I get to serve.

Domenic: I represent a union that collects dues from members. So what do we do with those dues? A lot of people ask, we give back to our community. So we work with our members. We did initiatives in TCHC, which was my base job.

Domenic: And there was, I'll tell you a story where we went to a community before school started, and we got backpacks full of school supplies and gifts for kids.

Domenic: Now in TCHC, we have all levels of renters and owners, but a lot are under rent-geared-to-income. Can't necessarily afford as much as somebody who's working or has full-time work or employment.

Domenic: And during that, we try to put on movie nights for kids, barbecues in communities, and we'll give back.

Domenic: I remember giving this child or a coworker of mine, we're all handing out backpacks to kids. And one came up and said, “You're just giving this to me?” And we said, “Yeah.” And I asked, “Why?” “No one has ever just given me anything. What is it? What's behind it?” I said, “Nothing. We just work here. We're happy to work here. We want to give back to our community.”

Domenic: And because of that, we started becoming really, really close with a lot of the tenant leaders and the tenants that work there. And now, like you said, we're a partnership. We're a team, we're a family. It doesn't matter if you're a worker or a tenant. We're all on the same team trying to ensure people are living in a community that's a bit more respectful, a bit more clean and a bit more healthy and a bit more safe.

Domenic: So because of that, I mean, that's part of public service rather than just a corporate bottom line. So I'm happy I chose this path. I know my members are, and we're proud to work in the city and province.

Celine: That's beautiful. Thank you. Wendy?

Wendy: I think Amy said it beautifully in terms of that calling to public service and what you're doing and delivering every day and seeing it on the ground.

Wendy: And I think to the experience that I've had here at the City of Ottawa, I've been here for 30 years. I've actually been in the city a little bit longer than that. And watching the community grow in terms of the work that the municipality does.

Wendy: So whether it's growth through what's happening with the planning and development, I think of our transit system, our light rail that has grown, the services we're offering through our community and social services, helping the homelessness, the 10-year housing and homelessness plan, it's all about that.

Wendy: And it's all about being involved in those things and making change for the good in the organization and for the community. So it's an amazing opportunity and it's incredible to be a part of that.

Celine: I can just, I mean, each of you, I can feel your energy and your passion and your caring for what you do. Thank you so much for your service.

Celine: I'm sure all of our listeners are gonna be, if they're not already a municipal employee, are gonna like run out there and find a way to be part of it. So thank you all.

Amy: You're welcome.

Domenic: Thank you.

Wendy: Thank you for having us. Thank you.