The Pension Blueprint podcast video transcript 

Episode 10: From paycheque to pension: Understanding the journey

Jackie DeSouza: Chris, welcome to "The Pension Blueprint."

Chris Hayle: Thank you for having me.

Jackie: I should say welcome back to "The Pension Blueprint."

Chris: Yes.

Jackie: 'Cause for season one, you were one of our co-hosts.

Chris: Right, that's where I'm in the other seat.

Jackie: Correct.

Chris: This time around I'm very excited to be here today.

Jackie: I get to ask the questions and you get to answer them for me.

Chris: Go for it.

Jackie: That's awesome. So, for those who haven't met you or haven't seen our season one episodes, can you tell us about your role at OMERS and what is it that your team does?

Chris: Absolutely, so I'm with the Pension Education and Relationship Management team at OMERS. Been with the team for around seven years now. And what we do is we travel all throughout the great province of Ontario meeting with our members, to give them the information they need to make the most out of their OMERS pension. So, think of it like giving our members the A to Z, about how their OMERS pension works, and a key aspect of our role as well is engaging with our employer administrators to build partnerships with them to make sure that they have the tools and knowledge to administer the OMERS pension plan on behalf of their members.

Jackie: What's it like for you being the public face of OMERS at all of these different events that you're at?

Chris: It's amazing being able to go out there and meet with our members. I think it's an important responsibility to be that OMERS ambassador and represent OMERS and get out there and meet all of our members. And we're meeting members all across the province of Ontario, many cities and towns, they're coming from all walks of life. OMERS members, they're our friends, they're our family members, they're our neighbors. And being able to get out there and get the chance to get to know them, and we have that responsibility to give them the information they need to make the most out of their OMERS pension. So, we definitely don't take that responsibility lightly.

Jackie: So, Chris, I want to put you on the spot a little bit and ask you, when you started with OMERS seven years ago, what did you know about the pension plan?

Chris: I'll be completely honest, I didn't really know much about the OMERS plan or pensions as a whole when I first joined OMERS. I think once I graduated from university, like any new grad, I went online and looked at the different job postings, I saw OMERS and I learned a little bit about OMERS in a retirement course.

Jackie: Mm-hmm.

Chris: Right before I finished up university. So, that sparked my interest. And starting out in the call center, I was able to learn about the OMERS plan and the different features, key aspects of the plan. And I was really able to develop an understanding about the importance of a pension. And probably if it wasn't for this role and being at OMERS, I may not still know the importance of a pension plan, let alone a defined benefit plan like OMERS. That is very valuable, providing that stable, secure source of retirement income for our members for as long as they live. So, understanding the value of pensions, but how important a defined benefit pension plan is for our members as well.

Jackie: Right, so for our members who are out there listening, don't feel bad if you don't know anything at this point, because look, our expert who knows everything from my perspective, didn't know about the plan either when he first started. At OMERS, we often talk about the pension promise, right? That we make this commitment to pay pensions for life to our members. So, I'm sure you get asked about that on the road, given the economy, you know, cost of housing, all of these things that are causing stress in our economy. What do you say when members ask you, no matter what age they are, you know, will you actually pay me a pension for life no matter when I retire?

Chris: And that's a fair question given the current—

Jackie: Mm-hmm.

Chris: State of the economy, right? And I'd say the great thing about the OMERS plan is it's a defined benefit plan. And what that means, it's a lifetime pension payable for as long as a member lives, members will never outlive their OMERS pension. We have over 300 members over the age of 100 still collecting their OMERS pension. Our oldest member is 109 years of age. So, it just goes to show you that it is a lifetime pension we are paying out to our members. So, there is that peace of mind. You know, we've been around since 1962. We've paid out that pension to our members the first banking day of every month to our retirees.

Jackie: So, when members are new to OMERS, what are some of the most common questions you'll get from them when you're out, you know, visiting the different municipalities and presenting on the plan?

Chris: Right, so when we meet with new members, some of the questions that we are getting is regarding the plan basics. They're new to OMERS and they're trying to get an understanding as to how this OMERS pension works. So, we drill down and we discuss that OMERS is a defined benefit pension plan. It's based on a formula. And there's two factors that go into the calculation of a member's pension, which is credited service, their years paying in and their earnings. So, we talk about those plan basics, the retirement milestones, and then members want to know how do they maximize their OMERS pension, how do they get the most out of it? And that's an example where we talk about maximizing, there's also the option for transferring pensions into the OMERS plan as well. So, maybe we have a member who worked for an employer outside of OMERS in the past, paying into another pension plan outside of OMERS, and they left that employer, haven't touched their pension just yet. That's the option to transfer it over—

Jackie: Mm-hmm.

Chris: Into the OMERS plan and have it recognized as service as well. And then we talk about the other key features of the plan. So, the AVCs, which is short for additional voluntary contributions, that's a separate investment opportunity in the OMERS plan. Members are in the AVCs as well, which is an opportunity to invest in the OMERS fund and get that same rate of return that OMERS gets on the investment portfolio. So, it's a matter for our new members, educating about those key aspects of the OMERS pension plan, and then talking about, you know, how they can maximize their OMERS pension.

Jackie: Right, and just to be clear, the additional voluntary contributions, the AVCs, it's a separate account, right?

Chris: Right.

Jackie: And you're paying into that separately.

Chris: Exactly, yeah.

Jackie: But as you said, it gets the same return as the OMERS fund that our pensions get.

Chris: Right, so the AVCs are completely separate—

Jackie: Mm-hmm.

Chris: From the OMERS pension, won't impact a member's pension in any way.

Jackie: Right.

Chris: And kind of similar to an RRSP.

Jackie: Right—
In a sense, right. It's considered a longer term—
Right.

Chris: Investment and members have the opportunity to set up automatic contributions on a biweekly or monthly basis out of their bank account. They can transfer funds from a registered retirement vehicle. So, there are flexible options to contribute—

Jackie: Mm-hmm.

Chris: To the AVCs, but you're right. Yeah, the rate of return OMERS gets in its investment portfolio, by having an AVC account, members get that same rate of return. If you look at our 2024 rate of return, it was 8.3%. And our 10-year average sitting at 7.1%, our average net investment return. So, an opportunity for members to invest and maybe diversify their investment portfolio.

Jackie: Yeah, for sure. And for members who are listening to us and they're interested in this, you can go to omers.com, look up AVCs, additional voluntary contributions, and you can find a lot of information on those or call our contact center and you know, someone would be happy to help you out. So, those are great ways of maximizing the pension. Let's talk about other income sources that a person could have in retirement, right? Our members have the OMERS pension, they may have AVCs, you mentioned RSPs there, I know there are government pensions. Can you talk a little bit about those?

Chris: Right, and it's very important for members when they are thinking about retirement to think of it from all those sources of retirement income they'll receive. And the way I like to frame it or visualize it for our members is think of retirement like a retirement puzzle. Every member has different pieces to their retirement puzzle. Some pieces are smaller, some pieces are larger for certain members. And we break it down by the income foundation, which is, think of it like a house at the end of the day. So, the income foundation is those secure and stable sources of retirement income that members will receive for as long as they live. So, the OMERS pension and like you mentioned, those government sources, the CPP, Canada Pension Plan and OAS, old age security, and you mentioned those additional savings tools that members may have as well. So, members might have an AVC account with us, TFSAs, RSPs, those tax-assisted savings, but they could have other savings and investments on top of that as well. So, all those pieces go into the puzzle. But very important to think of it like that house with the income foundation, those secure and stable sources of retirement income and the roof of the house, those additional savings tools. And we actually have a very neat resource that's on the website.
It's the retirement income sources hub with lots of detailed information about those government sources, the income foundation, the OMERS pension, and factoring those additional savings tools as well.

Jackie: Yeah, no, that's fantastic. And there's also a retirement calculator, right? So, if people want to go to that, you have to sign into your myOMERS account to get to that tool. You can plug in all these different amounts and also different years that you may want to retire. And it'll spit out numbers for you, right? That'll help you decide when would be the optimal time to retire.

Chris: Right, that's a very valuable tool. I strongly encourage all our members to get on there and use. And you're right, members can plug in some different dates that they're thinking about retiring, and those estimates will show them exactly what their pension will look like at those retirement dates. You can run as many estimates—
As you want. I jokingly say I go on there every Monday morning after long weekends to run those estimates to see how I'm looking. But yeah, it's a very valuable tool and resource that I strongly encourage all members use to get an idea as to what that OMERS pension will look like. But it's also important to have an understanding about what those other sources will look like. So, the government sources, CPP, OAS and those other additional savings tools that members are expecting to receive in retirement as well.

Jackie: Yeah, that's great. Thanks, a lot for that. So, Chris, I'm sure at some of these seminars and webinars that you do, you bring up the myOMERS platform, right? Can you tell us in, you know, just big picture, what is the platform and what can members do on there?

Chris: Right, so that's an online resource for OMERS members. And think of it like online banking for your pension. So, you sign into your myOMERS account and lots of great tools and resources to learn about the OMERS pension and see where you're at with the OMERS pension as well. So, some key features in myOMERS is the estimator tool where members can project what their pension would look like at certain retirement dates. Members can access their annual pension statements in there as well, and other resources and tools members can access in myOMERS. Members have the option to set up their AVC accounts directly through myOMERS. Maybe they're looking at maximizing their OMERS pension. They can start up a buyback estimate and costing in their myOMERS account online and thinking about survivor benefits, updating the beneficiary details in myOMERS. And there's also a number of ways to get in touch with us online. So, starting up a live chat or sending us a secure communication message. Lots of great things that you can do in myOMERS.

Jackie: Yeah, that's great. And for our members who have not yet signed up for their myOMERS account, you would definitely recommend that they do that, right?

Chris: Absolutely. I'd say first thing, maybe you're new to the OMERS pension plan, just starting out. Maybe you're partway through your career, just haven't gotten the chance to get into myOMERS. I plug myOMERS as often as I can, make sure you get on there. You can set up an account in a couple quick and easy steps. You create a username and password and off you go. You're in myOMERS.

Jackie: So, Chris, when you're on the road, you're meeting with all types of people, right? With varying levels of financial literacy and understanding of their pension. So, you know, and some people may be afraid to ask questions, they may even be afraid to sign up for a webinar or a seminar. But if they do come, how do you broach their questions and how do you answer their questions when they seem sort of scared to ask them?

Chris: Yeah, that's a fair point. And you know, when we're traveling across the province, I think there's a lot of time where sessions are, lots of people are in these sessions. There's newer members, mid-year career members and members that are getting very close to retirement. And it's understandable where they get into the room and they may not be comfortable asking their questions right away. But it's important for us as a team to level set our discussion and ensuring members can ask any questions they may have about the OMERS pension, and then we get into the A to Z, right? We educate our members in digestible language to help them understand about the OMERS pension, to give them the opportunity to ask any questions they have throughout our sessions. And of course, there's the opportunity after the presentation, a lot of them approach us. Maybe they have any certain personal questions they didn't want to ask to the group. We can exchange contact information, we talk off to the side after. So, there's a number of ways that our members can get in touch with us.

Jackie: That's great. So, they can have that personal conversation as well.

Chris: Right.

Jackie: There's also our contact center, right? And they don't have to call if they don't want to. We have live chat and they can also send an email through a secure communications if they have a question that they want to ask. So, it's good for our members to know that various ways to reach out if they have questions. And look, I've had questions and I've had them answered very well from our staff. So, what I want to suggest to people is don't be afraid to ask those questions. It's important to understand your pension. And it's important to get the information you need, like you said, you know, to make the best decisions for your own retirement.

So, Chris, I'm sure you get lots of very specific questions in these sessions that you do either online or in person, can you give some examples of the different cases and the very specific questions that members ask. For example, someone who's going to be going off on maternity leave and what the impact could be on their pension, or some people may have questions about survivor benefits or buybacks or transfers, all sorts of different things that you have to then respond to. So, can you give us, you know, examples of some of these specific situations?

Chris: Right, we get a number of questions from our members when we are delivering these presentations to them. To your question about members who are going off on an unpaid leave of absence, for instance, members want to know the impact of their pension once they go off on that leave. And to the example of an expectant mother who's going on leave in the near future. I actually spoke with a member a few weeks ago at a conference for non-teaching school board staff, and she wanted to know what is going to happen to her pension when she's off on that leave. So, there was a bit of uncertainty there, but I told her that she'll have the opportunity to purchase that leave period to make up the time that she was not working while off on that leave. And it's great to know that here at OMERS we are introducing more flexible financial options for our members to purchase credited service when they're going off on an unpaid leave of absence. We definitely value the financial wellness of our members and understanding that members that are going off on a leave for an extended period of time, they definitely have questions as to what their own pension will look like, but there is the opportunity to make up those contributions while off on a leave period.

Jackie: I know we've talked about different examples of ways members can maximize the OMERS pension. We get questions from members who have recently joined and they paid into another pension plan in the past. They want to know is there the option to bring it over? How do they bump up their OMERS pension? What are some of those opportunities there that we've talked about today?

And survivor benefits. Lots of questions about what's going to happen to their spouse. Sometimes we have husband and wife coming to the session together and they want to know how their significant other is going to be protected in the event they were to pass away.

And sometimes we have members who have returned to work, maybe they were off work for an extended period of time due to an illness or injury. That's another key feature in the OMERS pension plan as well. For members that are going through a challenging time, there are disability benefits available in the OMERS pension plan. So, members may have some questions about that. They might be going through the process of applying for disability benefits with OMERS and, you know, questions at the end of the day, what's their pension going to look like? And at that point in time, that's when we direct them to their myOMERS. Make sure you use that estimator, those tools that are available to show you what your pension will look like when you do retire.

Jackie: The other thing I'm thinking about is we have a very large membership, right? That represents six generations at least. So, we have to find different ways to serve them and write and talk to them. Someone who's 80 may not want to connect with us in the same way that someone would who is 15 or 16, right? So, and our internal research tells us that a person's comfort with financial information often determines their comfort with learning about their pension and interacting with OMERS, even more so than their career stage.
Are you seeing that out there in the field? Like are you seeing younger members come and are you seeing, you know, or is it mostly people who are close to retirement?

Chris: I'd say for a lot of the time it's members that are in later stages— of their career. But more and more we are seeing with the new resources that we are introducing to our members that the younger demographic is definitely starting to get more engaged with the OMERS plan. With the Pension podcast into season three, that's another way we're trying to bring in our younger members to learn about the OMERS pension plan. And we also have a number of other interactive resources that our members can use as well, which may cater to our younger demographic. We have online webinars that our members can register for on our website to learn about other aspects—of the OMERS pension plan. But there are those members as well that prefer to engage with us in person. So, we do host regional sessions in hubs across the province where members can come out. We talked about those in-person presentations that we do as well.

So, that's an opportunity for our members to engage with us and learn about the OMERS pension. You highlighted getting in touch with our member experience team. A member may want to call and ask their questions directly.
And those tools available in myOMERS to get in touch with us and learn about their pension.
Right.
As well.

Jackie: Yeah, no, that's great. And do you see differences when you're out on the road in terms of what, maybe you said it's mainly people who are closer to retirement, but are there differences in the demographics of the questions that you'll get?

Chris: Yeah, that's a fair question. I'd say so. I'd say members who are in their later stages and starting to think about retirement—their questions sort of focus on putting together that full picture and what it'll look like for them when they're retiring in the next few years. They want to know about the OMERS pension of course, but those government sources. We get lots of questions about how their CPP will work, how their OAS fits into the equation and putting together that full retirement picture and survivor benefits, like we talked about. They really want to know how their loved ones are protected in the event of their passing.

But if I compare that to newer members that are at our sessions and learning about the OMERS pension plan, they have questions more so focused on those plan basics. They're new to the plan, they're still learning about how things work. So, we educate about the formula, like we talked about—those retirement milestones and ways that younger members can maximize their OMERS pension.

Jackie: Right, no, that's important. It's important throughout the life cycle, right?

Chris: Right.

Jackie: So, you know, beyond the pension, what are some other things that someone may need to think about in their retirement? In terms of how they're going to actually live their lives? I know the team has introduced a new seminar, right? About living your 100 year life. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Chris: Absolutely. So, we did recently introduce the concept of retiring well. Yes, the OMERS pension's important. Yes, the government sources, those additional savings tools are important as well when planning. But we know that society's aging and members are living a lot longer than ever. You know, circling back to our 109 year old member, our stat of members over the age of 100, that's growing every year. So, it's important for us to now educate our members about those other important elements, besides those dollars and cents that go into retiring well, so those social connections. You know, people lose about 50% of their social connections when they do retire. A lot of that's tied to their work. What's their purpose and identity going to look like in retirement? Again, that purpose, that identity, a lot of it at the time of retiring is, you know, their work. So, they're now retired, they're not working anymore, what's that purpose and identity going to look like and the overall health and wellbeing, the mindset that needs to be carried into and thought about in retirement. So, we are starting to definitely educate about those other critical elements that do go into retiring well.

Jackie: Right, so it's mental health as well as physical health. We talked to another guest about results of a survey that showed that physical health was what was a consideration as well for people, right?

Chris: Yeah.

Jackie: So, when you do that seminar on, you know, how to take care of these other aspects of retirement, what is some of the advice that's given to members?

Chris: Mm, yeah, that's a great question as well. So, a key piece of advice is thinking about what you're going to do with your time is a key topic that we do focus on. And drilling it down into a granular level, right? What's your day going to look like from Monday to Friday during the week? What are your weekends going to look like? What are your seasons going to look like as well? I know we have some members who, you know, in the springtime throughout the summer, maybe they're on the golf course or maybe they're snowbirds and in the wintertime they're traveling as well. There's 24 hours in the day. So, how are you going to fill up your time?

The overall health and wellbeing, it's never too late to start getting healthier and more active in retirement as well, right? It's never too late to focus on your overall health and wellbeing and establishing social connections. So, it's important to highlight, it's not about the quantity of those social connections, the quality also matters as well. So, how are you going to maintain or carry those social connections and make new social connections in retirement? And it's a time of reinventing yourself as well, right? Members now, if they retire at, you know, 55, 65 years of age, they may have 30 years of time that they need to reinvent themselves and take on new challenges, new hobbies as well. So, really getting that into the minds of our members to think about that next chapter and reimagining retirement.

Jackie: Yeah, I like that. Reinventing yourself, thinking of new opportunities, right? Instead of saying, okay, I'm done now. And having all your eggs sort of in that one basket. Because most of us, we spend a lot of our lives working. Some of us may be in the same job for a long time. All of our friends are there, and you know, maybe you retire earlier, your friends don't have time to hang around with you every day.

Chris: Right.

Jackie: Like you said, you've got to think about 24 hours, right? And how are you going to spend that time?

Chris: Yeah.

Jackie: So, I really like what you said about reinventing yourself. What are some options for people in their retirement? I know people, some people want to continue working, right? They may want to go part-time or they might may want to do some volunteer work. What are your suggestions?

Chris: Yeah, and that's a great point. I think it's important to stay active in the community, right? There's opportunities to volunteer in your community and members. You know, they may also take on the challenge of going back to work in retirement in a part-time capacity. I think when you think of it from an OMERS perspective, that's definitely an option to work part-time. You just need to think about how it may impact the OMERS pension. You can't pay into the plan and collect your pension at the same time, but you can most definitely still work—
In retirement. So, the opportunity to, you know, volunteer, stay active in the community and think about perhaps taking on some part-time work is an option as well.

Jackie: Yeah, and that's an interesting point you made. So, if you start taking your pension and then say in retirement, you're saying, okay, I actually want to work some more. And you take on say a part-time role with an OMERS employer, could be the same one, could be another one. What are the options then? You either take your pension or can you stop it?

Chris: Yeah, so there are two options available and the rule of thumb is you can't collect and pay into the plan at the same time. So, if you retire, you're collecting your OMERS pension, the opportunity arises to go back to work for an OMERS employer, you can most definitely continue to receive your pension. But if you wanted to re-enroll in the plan, your pension would have to stop. You'd start making those contributions again, and then we'd go ahead and recalculate your pension when you retire based on those updated earnings and service paid into the plan. If you go to work for an employer outside of OMERS, no impact to your OMERS pension whatsoever. You'll simply continue to receive your OMERS pension the first banking day of every month.

Jackie: Okay, that's really important to know. You know, as we've talked a lot about the benefits of the OMERS pension, the different components of it. If someone new comes along, like what are the key takeaways that you want that member to leave with in terms of the OMERS pension?

Chris: Yeah, so the key takeaways for new members in the OMERS pension plan is understanding that it is a benefit that is payable for as long as our members live in retirement. And throughout that pension journey, understanding that OMERS is going to be there for you through those major life milestones. And for our newer members to understand what's in it for them at the end of the day and how to maximize their OMERS pensions. But I recommend reaching out to us, a member experience team, members may have paperwork from us and want to walk through the paperwork. If they have questions, reach out to us through myOMERS or simply give us a call. Our members might be going through a challenging time. The last thing they want to do is, you know, go through all this paperwork on their own and have to make that decision. Get in touch with us, we'll give you the information you need to make that informed decision as to what's best for you.

Jackie: Yeah, and I've been to some of your seminars and I've seen people show up with their statements, right? And all of their sort of sometimes file folders, full of information, which is really important. And our team, your team will actually walk through it with them and explain to them what all the numbers on the statements mean. And I think that's so valuable for our members to actually not just generic examples, but get specific information about their situation.

Chris: Right, exactly. And we're there for our members at the end of the day. I think that's one of the other great parts about my job being able to get out there and meet with our members. We understand members are taking the time out of their busy days. It's in the evening, they've worked all day, and they're still taking that time to come out and see us.

So, we're making sure that we are delivering that service to our members to make sure they have all the information they need to make those important decisions about their pension.

Jackie: Yeah, that's wonderful Chris. And I know within OMERS we call your team the road warriors and you really are, because you're out there, you're meeting with people, you're traveling every day and you're giving those members kind of the peace of mind that they need, right? In terms of their understanding of the pension.

Chris: Right. Exactly, we are the OMERS ambassadors getting out there and meeting with our members. I've been to many beautiful cities and towns across this great province of ours and getting the opportunity to go out to our member spaces as well. Getting out to see them at their municipal offices, you know, community centers, children's aid societies and police and fire halls as well. It's great to get out there and have the opportunity to engage and interact with our members, and give them the information they need and answer any questions they have about their OMERS pension. So, it's kind of a sense they're serving us in our communities, kind of return that favor, right? Helping them out with their OMERS pension, they're paying into it, making sure that we deliver on any questions that they have, and down the road that pension's waiting for them. So, giving them that peace of mind. They've gotten all the information they need, we've answered all their questions. They've gone into myOMERS, they've run their estimates, and they're making a well-informed decision, once they're getting into those stages of retiring.

Jackie: Yeah, and that's what we want for them to make great decisions. Thank you for being here today, Chris.

Chris: Thank you so much.